Trading With The Flow!!!

Part II of the Aban 60min thread.

MJ

greaaat new thread on aban :D……..

Yes,MJ,Correct…………..first time we have had this in the 60min Flow in a really long time.But yes,at 50% reverse.

Will make your stomach go queasy though to take a short after such a bullish move.

Saint

mj u too said reversal at 50 % of WRb…..

nd dis is monster WRB….

but y reverse at 50 %……finding hard to understand…..please throw some light…

regards

neeraj

Hi neeraj,
Its part of the original rules to the 60min flow if you remember. Thanks for bringing this up will update/add this scenario to the methods section.

Regards,
MJ

thanks mj…..

yes part of rules…true…..want to knw the insights :)

the low of wrb … yes the negation…..and false breakout … we reverse……but how 50 % a place to reverse……that is tough to understand….

thanks…will b waiting fr ur add on dis friend :)

Neeraj, After a good uptrend, we get an exhaustion move up. Usually this signals the end of the move. Its that stage where the retailers are frantically trying to buy at any price every tick advances 2 points.
Reversing at 33% of WRB. We use the 50% only for the next bar, which didnt trigger, now stops at 33%.

Still long, surprisingly…

Regards,
MJ-

This monster WRB in Aban is a live demo on how to handle such cases. So MJ you are taking a leaf out of Saint's lesson yesterday on monster WRB on miniflow here also.

Interesting application of lessons learned on price action.

Lets see how things turn out.

Aban is saved till now but NF and Banknifty have reversed!!!!

Bee

Yes True Bee, NF and bankNF reversed, but aban still long. Lets see how long its holds.

MJ

aban short now I guess?

vin

Yes Short now, hope the down move is as good and juicy as the upmove was.

MJ

aban shud crack down nicely if goes below the low of LARRRGE bar.

vin

Downmove looks pretty vertical so triggering 2 bar back stops now.

And my special thanks to MJ, I was away from home yesterday and MJ helped me put my trades at right price by confirming stops and all. Thanks a million

Downmove looks pretty vertical so triggering 2 bar back stops now.

And my special thanks to MJ, I was away from home yesterday and MJ helped me put my trades at right price by confirming stops and all. Thanks a million

ComeOn Prabh Sir ! Was an honour to assist you.
Was more worried about giving the wrong Stops…lol….

All enjoying the great downmove,

MJ

Yep MJ, enjoyed the upmove and now equally enjoying Downmove.

Cheers

Long now above 11 am bar high + filter

me 2 long……SAR lod - f

Neeraj I guess you would not have gone short, RSI 3 never gave a Sell signal and as far as I know you don't follow WRBs for reversals, right?

i do consider WRB's , false breakouts, breakdowns for reversals…..i dun follow RSI strictly…..it is just for helping me wid pivots….

regards

neeraj

Adds coming up above yesterday's high

SAR coming up yesterday's 3:30 bar low - f

by method today's 11 a.m. bar….yesterdays 3:30 bar low .50 diff only so posted 3:30 bar ….as pl's low is 3:30 bar low….

Reversals around the corner now.

MJ

Reversed to short ?

Nope Santosh, as you may know by now Aban still long. Even if your shorts did trigger then well EOD reversal would have you long anyway.

MJ

Thanks MJ.. Short wud have triggered for those who had their filters less than or equal to 5..
So current position is LONG .. Just wanted to confirm..

i use seven to reverse….

not reversed…still long..

Adds Triggered in Aban

For some strange reasons Aban is sleeping while rest of the markets are roaring, wake up man !

Yes Prabh,
Maybe when the rest of the market fizzles out then Aban will start thumping…lol….

MJ

Cannot really complain MJ, gave a hell lot of profits in last few trades

aban not moving at all….stops still at yesterday's lows - f…

can some one guide us about the aban flow….adds not looking good at all…what should we do??

Rishi you have learn to be very patient when trading Aban, it has given a handsome profits few days back so it would take a breather, just follow the Pivots and forget everything, if not comfortable with ADDs take them off right now but don't get frustated Aban has a habit of giving excellent trades after few Trades.

Hope that helps

i know prbhajeet….but the reason i was getting antsy was due to the new EOD reversal rule that we have put in place…so was thinking if there was a reversal due to those reasons which I might have missed…im still holding my longs with the adds….

moving stops to lod -f ….

finally aban showing some signs of life after a long time…we've got very good stops to reverse from now…

Rajesh, You wanted to discuss LT trades here, IF still keen Please do post on it.
If you are, will change the title to Aban/LT Trades.

MJ

can ne1 please explain today's case of aban ? ? we now move sar to 5 min bar low - f .. ?

Yes Neeraj Still long,
Stops at 5min low and holding

MJ

thanks mj :)

SAR at yest 3pm bar low - filter .. Please confirm..

Yes Santosh, SAR at 3 pm bar low

thanks prabh.. i think after 1 pm we can change it to todays 11am bar low..

moving it to lod - f….

Correct Santosh, we have a new SAR now

SAR at 11pm low on 9th-f

Saint

SAR moved to today's 1pm bar low ?

WRB Breakout in Aban… 2 more mins to go… Bringing the stops to the low of WRB.. will wait for the next bar to kick in 50% of WRB rule.

Correct Stops at Low of WRB……what a pleasant surprise…Good boy Aban

Regards,
MJ-

MJ/senthil, what was your SAR in ABAN bfore the market opened today? was it 9th 3.30pm bar low OR 13th 1pm bar low?

Did anyone reverse to short below 12pm bar? (Wasn't a PL in hourly charts but was a clear PL in 30 min)

No one is active here? :(

Extremely sorry Santosh somehow I am missing posts in the "recent posts" section. Anyway…

We reversed to shorts on the 16th, our stops at 514.4+Filter this morning, we are holding shorts still.
Will update more regularly now-on.

Regards,
MJ-

Thanks MJ. Need one clarification though. Did you enter shorts below 16th 12pm bar low or 2pm bar low?

Also hope we can move our stops to 17th 12pm bar high + filter..

My trade so far……

MJ-

SAR yesterday's 3.30pm bar high + f

Still short with stops at yesterday's 1400 bar….These periods of inactivity in aban are difficult. But in the end it will pay off…

MJ-

Can we move stops to yestdays (21st) high+filter now? Also a doji in daily ..

A more clear pivot using RSI(3) wud be 20th 3.30pm bar high ..

Leaving RSI aside, yesterday's high + filter looks a good place to go long

Still short, Longs look good at the high of he last bar on the 20th. Meaning 485.55+filter.

Regards,
MJ-

Thanks prabh and MJ. Please be active here :)

MJ, New lows in Aban , also double top @ 478. So isn't it safe to move our stops to 478+f..
Morning it opened (gap) up above the falling wedge.. So I thought bulls are back into action.. Anyway lets wait n see..

Absolutely Santosh stops at today's high +filter.
478+Filter

Regards,
MJ-

Stops move down again , now at a newly formed pivot yesterday (last 2 bars)

MJ-

Still short, holding tight while all other stock reverse, its quite normal for stocks to have a great trend up and reverse to shorts while aban was short the entire time. Certain characteristic of this stock. But better payoff as well

MJ-

aban failed breakdown…….

now long! what a move..

Nice reversal, last minute though, My trade…

Regards,
MJ-

but MJ, closing price is shown as 456 ! eventhough it went upto 469.9 .. :(

MJ,

Today we had 4 hours (bars) of sideways trading in Aban as per your chart above. Normally after how many hours will you consider this a sideways movement and a pivot? I remember many instances in our early days at TJ, we used to take these sideways movements after 4 bars or so. Plus 3 pm bar was also in the similar range and also the 1st 5 min bar.

If you take this as sideways pivot then SAR could have been brought down to 12 noon bar hi.

Bee

with u beeeth :) :) rsi indicated it as pivot

thou rather then taking that hod and failed breakdown worked just fine :)

that doesn't matter Santosh. There is a adjusted close, we are completely unaffected with that. As far as our trade goes, we are long , stops at previous pivot lows.

Regards,
MJ-

Hi Bee ! :)
Reliance is an ideal example of when we can move stops when the sideways period begins. Usually i want atleasta few bars after the pivot has formed In this case it was just 2 bars so didnt use the pivot. But again its what the eye sees that we go with.

Thats just my way of doing things, different people, different ways. Especially with Aban, I want to be anything but aggressive. Once it moves, it keeps going that way, being stopped out at every pivot will just make things complicated.

Warm Regards,
MJ-

Agree with MJ, in case of ABAN we better let stock do everything it wants to do, yesterday's Pivot was where even my stops were, long along with everyone now

SAR at yest WRB low?

still keeping it at Pivot. Whats your opinion prabh?

MJ

Myself keeping Stops at WRB

Great, Add 1 triggers. Stops move to PL

MJ

MJ, stops still at 467-f ?

Yep Santosh Aban's SAR remains unchanged as yet

thanks prabh

what happened? aban now at 442.. SL also not triggered :(

hmm.. q4 results announced.. may b bcoz of that.. what to do now? exit and go short at CMP?

have anyone faced this situation in 60-min flow - stock futures?

Hello

Hope everyone could get out in time, a 15% monster WRB :(

My stops hit but did not get filled in on the full order, squared longs with some more slippage…

Could not get in short, reason: heisitation :))

Going home flat on ABAN

Thanks
Rajesh

pl breaks we go short….no looking at ne other thing :)…..

and yes happ many times…….follow the plan dats it :)

Hello Neeraj

At what rate did you get your short in? I could have got in only around 445-50, but a bit of hesitation & price was in 20's :)

Thanks
Rajesh

Santosh/Rajesh,
What was the trigger price and limit price you specified for your stop orders. It would help to know and avoid such cases later. On nifty I keep my limit price 20-30 points away from my trigger price. Haven't faced any problem with this yet. Fills are usually within 1 point.

I am not trading ABAN at the moment.

Nitin

Hello Nitin

With ABAN I have been using difference of 3 - 5 points (trigger & Limit), usually had no problems with fills, this was one of those special cases, thankfully (whatever the news event) it happened during the market hours.

Compared to the gap situation a few points of extra slippage is no big deal :),

So all part of trading

Thanks

mine was @ 460 nitin.. did not trigger.. i mean SL order triggered but didnt get fill..

Hi Rajesh,
Fill with 3-4 points is not a problem. Problem occurs when your order doesn't get filled at all. As has happened in Santhosh's case. This happened to me once some time back in Nifty when I was using a difference of 3-4 points (Nifty was around 3K then).

At least my NIFTY experience says use a larger diff between limit and trigger. Exchange anyway gives the best price possible. This works for liquid contracts like NIFTY and should work for ABAN too.

Nitin

So everyone faced slippage yesterday?? Same here, luckily my broker called when Aban was at 440 and my stops didn't get executed. Am not in the short trade right now but will join on getting Lower PH

anyone still in the flow? whats the SAR for the current short position? (i exited at 439 but did not enter shorts. now looking for a suitable re-entry)

same with me Prabh.. whats ur opinion in entering shorts below yesterday's low - filter?

Santosh I am looking to get a lower SAR to put a position, right now stops are too far to have good Position Size, waiting for a pullback rt. now

Funny how so many people can end up doing the same thing.

Im in the same boat as prabhjeet, waiting for a lower PH to get in short.

MJ-

:) will be joining you in the Short trade Prabh and MJ. Could not get in the Short yesterday..though thankfully didnt get a wild slippage on my Long stops.

Thanks,

Puneet

Puneet plz. do join, it would be nice to have your insights.

Guys could we go short below the Pivot lo today and may be take HOD as our STOPS

your right prabhjeet, Risk mangeable at this level. Still thinking, maybe missed the bus this time

MJ

We guys have been chasing the Tail of ABAN up and down, had 4-5 bad trades but when the real large winner came, the bigger players didn't let us enter, Hard Luck, isn't it ??

I was long till yesterday….but price jumped so couldnt get in the Shorts.

would now like to wait for a pullback….and then will Short the low of the bar making a lower high on the 60. Risky…..but dont have a choice this time.

All this only if it happens now. If the main trade already gives 1-2 adds….then wil have to forget it this time.

Puneet

rajesh i didn short aban(60 min)….saw ur post now….. :)

Long Topping Tail on Aban, looking to short below the 11 am bar, what say Puneet??

Alright, now short Aban, STOPS above HOD

Sorry Prabhjeet Paaji…saw your post just now.

yes..will short at break of 391-f and keep stops then at todays high. not much difference between ydays low and 11am low..so will wait for ydays low.

If I were to go Short now…..I will keep stops at ydays 12pm high.

Puneet

Good now even Puneet sir must have joined me, but frankly speaking Shorts not looking good, the bar we entered is a Long Hammer, never a good bar to short, lets see how it pans out

Still waiting on the sideline Prabhjeet Sir.. I use a rather bigger filter…and am waiting for ydays low to break before entering.

Will join you soon in Aban.

Puneet

Can't we consider 11am high as a PH and enter longs above it ? But as tomorrow and fridays r holidays bit reluctant to enter long side.. also hourly is still trading below 20 EMA ..

Now Sar at 2 pm high+f….

Aban goes home short. Although not in this trade, just holding my ril and NF 60min longs.

MJ-

Aban is short??? Not according to me, I think we had a Pivot hi at around 399.85 on May series and by 3 pm it was taken out along with Filter though Longs were not triggered for April series.

Cannot understand why we don't take these Pivots when we have traded them successfully in the past.I may be proven wrong by A Big Gap Down Open on Monday but my view for the position still remains Long

Fantastic Prabh, Actually I don't follow may (next month) charts until the current month is over. So According to April charts even if we take recent pivot high, still short. But i'm sure Monday will be a reversal day, I will enter Aban then surely and join you Prabh :)

Always a great pleasure and learning experience by knowing your stance on a particular scrip.

Regards,
MJ-

is it only me or anyone else still waiting for an entry in ABAN? :(

Still waiting for entry to longs, Aban still short for me.

MJ-

entering long above 11am high+f ..

SAR lod - f ..

Hope everybody is long now, SAR at lod

Finally long in Aban, as always Prabh Paaji entered much before me :)

MJ

look at volume with which MJ entered…

vineet

Just plain luck MJ, most of the time you end up on the right side. Anyways, there seems to be still lots of juice left.

Lol Vineet, looks like all the flow members are responsible for vol. spike :)

do we need to consider EOD reversal if closing is below 427 ?

MMMmm, will be taking EOD reversal in Aban if we close below PH. Although Prabh will remain long as today was an add day for him.
Another gap up tomorrow and entry and we will have dejavu….this has happened before.

EDIT: Ah Santosh posted before me, thanks….yes we will take EOD reversal if it comes , but since I hadn't shorted earlier will just exit longs.
Regards,
MJ-

About EOD reversal in Aban. The reversal point was PH made by 2 pm bar hi on 29.4.2009. Because of the gap up we could not go long at that point and waited for the PH made by 11 am bar hi to be taken out. Since a new PH was made above the reversal point - is EOD reversal valid today?
Bee

Interesting Bee, Put me in deep thought.
I would like Saint Sir's take on this.

MJ-

ADD 2 done on ABAN, SAR YESTERDAY'S 3 pm bar low - f

Looking at what happened yesterday, seems the EOD reversal was wrong….Thank you Bee for your comments,

but will follow the plan so will take take longs above pivot….meanwhile prabhjeet enjoys with his add2 …LOL….

This has to go down into the history books… :)

Regards,
MJ-

Frankly speaking MJ, I think an entry above today's high would be too late, think of this trade as Scratch Trade, better wait for Trend reversal now to enter

Agree with Prabh here, MJ. Though I do not think you will have to wait too much to enter this on the short side:-)
Bee

Thankx Prabh, will look into it.
Lets see what happens today.

MJ-

Filters keeping ABAN long, doesn't look like it would last long

at last got a clear breakout in ABAN.. but as Prabh said, isn't it too late to enter longs? MJ, ur views?

short in aban now..

Yes Santosh, I am Short too.

Yes Finally Got in Aban. Short now.

MJ-

Gud to know that all are "in the flow" .. :)

SAR as of now.. yesterdays high+f ..

Hmmm… shorts not working, looks like we will get reversal again :)

MJ, prabh, still keeping yesterday's high as SAR?

Stops at todays high in Aban..

Agree with Puneet, SAR at HOD

SAR still at yesterday HOD + f ..

Close to Reversals now !

Waiting to reverse above yesterdays's high…missed by a few points, trigger anytime now I guess.

MJ-

reversal….sar to yesterday's lod-f…

Rishi,
Why not todays opening bar low.

Long triggered..

SAR - today's low

Great 6% up…Great!

MJ-

my charts stopped working again…as soon as they work, ill post why not today's low as sar for me….

Just a word of caution .. have ur SLs in place. Aban is too volatile today.. i saw the price jumping from 452 to 443 in less than a second ..

Also make sure there is some pts diff between ur trigger and execution prices..
I lost a huge amt when it declared q4 results last week.. (diff between trigger and exec price was just 1 or 2 points for me, and though SL was triggered my sell order never got executed.. i had to later exit the position at market price much lower than the trigger price)

sar at yesterday's low because it looks like a very valid visual pivot to reverse from…thats why…

My stops at 1400 bar low.

MJ-

MJ…1400 bar low is the lod of yesterday :)

looks like we'll get a new SAR very soon

Add1 triggers in Aban. :)
Hope Prabh is in this move.

MJ-

Add 1 triggers…..moving stops to 434-f.

Now..even if the add would have missed by a point or 2…still stops would have moved on cross of prev highs

Puneet

Have a tab on the Bo bar failure…..below the low of 3pm bar. Not saying it will hit….but better to be prepared

Add1 triggers in Aban. :)
Hope Prabh is in this move.

MJ-

Yep MJ, I am in the flow, added too

Missed the second ADD, was anyone lucky enough to put that ADD

SAR still at 434-f .. someone plz confirm ..

Spot on Santosh, looks like we will have a higher SAR soon

Yep.. I too think its 434.10-f.. Seniors kindly confirm..

Can we consider yesterday's low as a valid SAR.. ?

I too think yesterday's low as valid PL..seniors plz confirm

452-f now

Reversed to short now, SAR 468.9 + F

yep.. short with SAR at previous PH + f..

ps: MJ/puneet, page taking a while to load.. can u open a part 3 of this thread and close ths one? thanx..

Yep Santosh.

Closing this Thread down and onwards to Aban III